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PLATFORMBALLS
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5ivegearsinreverse
ROBERT JEKYLL & GORDON HYDE


Joined: 07 Nov 2018
Posts: 429
Location: Soke of Retardnumberplateshire

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 11:35 pm    Post subject: PLATFORMBALLS Reply with quote

I am indebted to Sandie (and Autocropley) for this snippet of knowledge:

Sandie wrote:
Meanwhile, they are taking deep measures: https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new-cars/land-rover-launch-heavily-revised-discovery-sport-summer

Quote:
Currently sitting on the D8 platform, the updated Discovery Sport moves over to the Premium Transverse Architecture, which underpins the new Evoque. Crucially, this mixed-material platform allows for electrification and enables more interior space to be created.


A bit extreme for a facelift, isn't it?


How clever of Tatuar to make their new platform capable of being reverse-engineered to be compatible with the Ford / Volvo EUCD based cars. And perish the thought that perhaps the "Premium Transverse Architecture" is perhaps not quite the tabula rasa these clever Tatuar engineers would like us to think it is.

Some rascally Forens are not above this sort of trickery, re-naming old platforms to make the gullible masses think that they're investing vast sums, as VAG and Bob do.

Actually, do the masses give a fuck? I suspect not. 'Scalable platforms' which can underpin everything from superminis to large saloons, with SUVs and vans in between are all about economies of scale, rather than the qualities of the end product.

Some of these products are going to end up being overweight, others will be under-engineered. Tailor the componentry to individual products and the original purpose is lost.

I suspect that the spread of platform and powertrain rationalisation is a signifer of the End of Days before legislation brings in the EV era, and car companies become technology businesses and mobility providers.
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Lord Sward
SWARDUS ET PKLESS


Joined: 08 Nov 2018
Posts: 759

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 11:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What are you saying Funf?
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Giles
DOING IT AGAIN FOR FUN AND PROFIT


Joined: 07 Nov 2018
Posts: 299

PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 8:54 am    Post subject: Re: PLATFORMBALLS Reply with quote

5ivegearsinreverse wrote:
the End of Days before legislation brings in the EV era, and car companies become technology businesses and mobility providers.


That is a genuinely upsetting thought. But you are probably right.
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Nick Besonderes
Modern Gentleman


Joined: 09 Nov 2018
Posts: 197
Location: Here

PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 10:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I read in ANE mag that one of the companies said exactly that - it's practically the end on innovation and the future is adding more electronic gewgaws on top of an old plank.

It's all a bit reminiscent of FIAT dropping a 124 shell onto the old 1500 plank to create the 125, because the 130 had suffered from too much project drift.
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marinast
IDEOLOGICAL RADONS


Joined: 07 Nov 2018
Posts: 534

PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 12:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Many might be predicting EVs will take over the world but for many drivers here in the UK living in a terraced house or flat without a driveway or convenient electric charging they make no sense.
The industry is simply hedging it’s bets, it knows the future is a wide range of power trains and short term why spend billions on a platform which is not ‘future proof’ when an older and just as capable platform already exists.
It’s hardly like companies are in the transition from cart springs to coil springs like the early 1980s, a chassis from 2015 will still give acceptable ride and handling even today so just tweak settings for different weight distribution and vehicle mass.
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Ottertronic
THE RUSSIANS!!


Joined: 09 Nov 2018
Posts: 566

PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 12:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Re-using platforms ad infinitum while adding 'high tech' trinkets on top is hardly new. It was the bedrock of the US car industry for much of the 20th century. Same old ladder chassis, now with electric windows and auto lights.

This Land Rover reporting is sloppy though. The EUCD box of bits has been through incremental change from Freeloader 2 to Ewok to Ecstasy-Pace to Disco Spurt to Ewok 2 but the idea that the last of those has a brand new platform is BALLHAIR, even if it probably has few interchangeable parts with its oldest forebears.
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Sandie
FLOPPY-TROUSERED BUCKFAST-SWILLING CUNT


Joined: 09 Nov 2018
Posts: 447
Location: The EPC

PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 4:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

marinast wrote:
Many might be predicting EVs will take over the world but for many drivers here in the UK living in a terraced house or flat without a driveway or convenient electric charging they make no sense.


In the future this will be irrelevant as the most likely outcome of some of the developments in autonomous tech will be the end of such a thing as a personal car.
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Seamaster
SCHRODINGER'S CUNT


Joined: 11 Nov 2018
Posts: 1097
Location: RUSSIA

PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 4:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sandie wrote:
In the future this will be irrelevant as the most likely outcome of some of the developments in autonomous tech will be the end of such a thing as a personal car.


Correct.
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620bob
HORMONAL REMAINIAC


Joined: 08 Nov 2018
Posts: 1027
Location: Bobniston

PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 4:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

...but will it really be the end? People like to have their own stuff.
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Nick Besonderes
Modern Gentleman


Joined: 09 Nov 2018
Posts: 197
Location: Here

PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd agree that once people become reasonably wealthy, they want their own shit. Or to rent it, at least. It's often unpleasant enough having to share a taxi with its driver.

I'd imagine most of this is blind panic caused by 'focus groups'.

Back in the 1970s, everyone was looking at acquiring Wankel licences because it was the new powertrain. That ended well for those who did. Perhaps that Felix's personal car was an Isabella Coupe might've been a hint.
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Giles
DOING IT AGAIN FOR FUN AND PROFIT


Joined: 07 Nov 2018
Posts: 299

PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 10:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ottertronic wrote:
Re-using platforms ad infinitum while adding 'high tech' trinkets on top is hardly new. It was the bedrock of the US car industry for much of the 20th century. Same old ladder chassis, now with electric windows and auto lights.

This Land Rover reporting is sloppy though. The EUCD box of bits has been through incremental change from Freeloader 2 to Ewok to Ecstasy-Pace to Disco Spurt to Ewok 2 but the idea that the last of those has a brand new platform is BALLHAIR, even if it probably has few interchangeable parts with its oldest forebears.


At what point do they have to stop paying a royalty to Ford for the platform?
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5ivegearsinreverse
ROBERT JEKYLL & GORDON HYDE


Joined: 07 Nov 2018
Posts: 429
Location: Soke of Retardnumberplateshire

PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 10:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nick Besonderes wrote:
Back in the 1970s, everyone was looking at acquiring Wankel licences because it was the new powertrain. That ended well for those who did.

Perhaps that Felix's personal car was an Isabella Coupe might've been a hint.


A man of discernment and good judgement, at least in his choice of cars. Not so sure about engineering matters or his politics - he was a bit right wing in the 1920s even before it was popular and profitable.

Felix did eventually own Ro80s; this one was on show at an exhibition in Neckarsulm last May:










The Wankel engine section badges are a nice touch, but isn't the late series "Ro80" badging horrible?
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Derek
SAUCEBOX


Joined: 10 Nov 2018
Posts: 221
Location: Upside down

PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 11:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looks fantastic in that colour. This thing must've offered some inspiration for the Audi B3.
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Nick Besonderes
Modern Gentleman


Joined: 09 Nov 2018
Posts: 197
Location: Here

PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2019 12:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Late badging is very 'corporate'.

Still a big woof! though. Correct colour and correct rimz.
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chucky
Modern Gentleman


Joined: 12 Nov 2018
Posts: 123

PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2019 2:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The only person who got the modular concept bob-on was Ed Turner.
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620bob
HORMONAL REMAINIAC


Joined: 08 Nov 2018
Posts: 1027
Location: Bobniston

PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2019 7:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We've come late to the party with TNGA, it's total upheaval for us, first new platform in 25 years.
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5ivegearsinreverse
ROBERT JEKYLL & GORDON HYDE


Joined: 07 Nov 2018
Posts: 429
Location: Soke of Retardnumberplateshire

PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2019 10:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

620bob wrote:
We've come late to the party with TNGA, it's total upheaval for us, first new platform in 25 years.


Festina lente...

It's only 23 years since the first unitary-bodied Crown.
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Nick Besonderes
Modern Gentleman


Joined: 09 Nov 2018
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Location: Here

PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 12:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

FFS, Bob - are you the new FIRM?
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5ivegearsinreverse
ROBERT JEKYLL & GORDON HYDE


Joined: 07 Nov 2018
Posts: 429
Location: Soke of Retardnumberplateshire

PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 11:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Firm were never much good on platform scaling, rather the opposite, for example underpinning the Farina A40 and A55 Mk2 with the mechanicals of their predecessors, then reworking them within two years with new chassis with longer wheelbases and wider tracks.

Then there was Triumph, butchering their first FWD car to accommodate a RWD drivetrain to save money and accommodate an engine which wouldn't fit any other way.

Some time before, BMC designed three cars around the same set of very recognisable doors, but with practically nothing else in common.

The only modest success in platform scalability was the LC10 series. If XX hadn't happened it would have been stretched to produce an SD1 replacement. Although it's never been suggested as far as I know, a supermini could have been a possibility too. It happened - in a very roundabout way - with R3, which has wheelbase and track dimensions within millimetres of the Maestro.
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Nick Besonderes
Modern Gentleman


Joined: 09 Nov 2018
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Troo, but they were very good at 23 year old platforms.

Only they ended up changing so much, that it wasn't. Yet the Allegro was an 1100 and the SD1 still had some Triumph 2000 bits, allegedly.

Fuck knows where bits of the Marina came from - MGB, Knacker, Morris Oxford probably.

Mind you, it's not unusual to recycle; the last Euro Accord was still a relative of the Rover 600.
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Ottertronic
THE RUSSIANS!!


Joined: 09 Nov 2018
Posts: 566

PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 11:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In what way was an Allegro an 1100, carryover A-series aside?
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austin-towers
PLASTIC WELSH SPASTIC


Joined: 07 Nov 2018
Posts: 494

PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 11:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

HERE WE GO
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Nick Besonderes
Modern Gentleman


Joined: 09 Nov 2018
Posts: 197
Location: Here

PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ottertronic wrote:
In what way was an Allegro an 1100, carryover A-series aside?


Did they not carry over the chassis (apart from being Hydragas) or is that just another one of those things they made up in the press somewhere?

Bit like the Metro being a cut-down Allegro.

Then there was Mann's four-door TR7, of which no evidence has ever been found.
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Ottertronic
THE RUSSIANS!!


Joined: 09 Nov 2018
Posts: 566

PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't think so. It was a brand new design and larger in every dimension.
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marinast
IDEOLOGICAL RADONS


Joined: 07 Nov 2018
Posts: 534

PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 1:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Engine and gearbox aside, the Allegro was a whole new design, it did not even use ADO16 subframes.
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